Enough negativity...a brighter side perspective.

Discussion in 'GarryP's Trojan Huddle' started by Trojan4life_itul1, Dec 21, 2019.

  1. Enough negativity...a brighter side perspective.
    Trojan4life_itul1

    Trojan4life_itul1 Junior Member


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    #1
    Helton sucks...but the old saying goes, he hit bottom and there's only one way to go from here, which is up.
    Objectively, recruiting is only partly his fault. His limbo status has more to do with current recruiting purgatory than his skill as a recruiter.
    Now, I think changes we have made last year did have some positive effect. I think this was the first time since Carroll era where we utilized multiple recievers. Offense made a significant jump in productivity.
    Although it is far from perfect but coaches (G.H. especially) had 2nd and 3rd QBs ready. Which is much better than any pre-Grahm Harrell Gomer era.
    Oline played better...even without game speed practices. Drevno is a definite upgrade.

    On defense...well, if we can get a better DC in than it would improve as well.

    So, even if it sucks to have Helton coaching next year, we might actually have a chance if other coaches are left to do their jobs.
    Helton's demishing role could actually make the team better...let him be the figure head...like the British Monarch.
     
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  2. CoronaTrojanFan

    CoronaTrojanFan Junior Member


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    #2
    Please go to ESPN, find the next showing of the Belichick/Saban discussion on coaching winning football and then ask yourself if Clay Helton could contribute anything useful in a conversation with those two guys; then ask yourself who might be able to do so among current or ex-coaches out there. The list is going to be pretty short.

    Don't disagree with your point that with Harrell and Drevno offense seems to work when they are left to do their particular jobs. Don't disagree with your point that a new DC (and defensive position coaches) might be able to execute similar improvements in the defense if left to their own devices. Just not sure that HCCH has exhibited the overall compelling desire to need to be competitive and be a winner to the extent that the examples of Belichick and Saban have shown.

    Do disagree that recruiting is not HCCH's fault. He's the head coach and under his watch this year recruiting was terrible in a way that indicated that it was not handled properly during the entire year and just not during the last couple of weeks.
     
  3. GoSC1

    GoSC1 Junior Member


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    #3
    Helton has a track record prior to last year of recruiting very well. If you think that him constantly being on the hot seat, coupled with that 11 day time in limbo did not have a major affect on this year, I don’t know what to say. The kids are not stupid, they, along with most of us, expected Helton to be fired at the end of the season. I think Helton might have as well.
    This recruiting fiasco is more on Bohn and Folt than Helton in my opinion
     
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  4. uscvball

    uscvball Junior Member


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    #4
    Link?
    A huge factor no doubt but I think you have to consider that the kids who are signing in this class, at least at the elite level, have been recruited by the top schools for several years now. As Helton himself said, the ones who signed are the ones who stuck around. So you have to ask yourself, why did they decide to stay and the elite players did not?

    Starting with the beat down we took against Alabama, the decline in our play this season, not going to a bowl game last season, and the initial sketchy reports from the players who did go to the NFL last year not being ready, and it all adds up to Helton.

    The players and their families are not blind. Anyone watching the games can see what the problems are but then they see clay at post game pressers talking about watching film and players as warriors. He is not addressing the problems nor is he being honest.

    What happened at the end here with the new president and the new athletic director didn't help but collectively they have been on the job for about 6 months.
     
  5. ConquerorSC

    ConquerorSC Points Member


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    #5
    The bad thing is that Clay Helton still hasn’t hit his bottom. Scary thought.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
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  6. trackdude

    trackdude Junior Member


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    #6
    I do wonder if we expected way too much from the new president & new AD in such a short period of time. They’ve been elsewhere while we’ve been stewing in our own piss over Helton for a few years now. IDK, seems unrealistic to expect these people to come in cold-turkey and make these huge decisions on such short notice.
     
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  7. BigGuard

    BigGuard Junior Member


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    #7
    True, firing Helton seems like such a no brainer. Yes, they're buyout questions, but everything I've read out there is pure speculation. Yes, UM was the dream scenario, but they're were a lot of strong candidates with "integrity".

    Likely Coach Bohn had no real sense or idea how bad the situation was at SC. The level of disdain for Helton has been brewing for two plus seasons. I imagine he was sitting in his office at Cincinnati and his agent called him and tells him USC is interested in him! He probably fell out of his chair with excitement! Being sheltered up in Ohio there is little chance he followed SC. We haven't been relevant in years.

    The fact that he based the decision on how SC finished the season and NOT against Helton's whole body of work speaks volumes. He came into the job with no perspective. I honestly think neither he nor Folt did their due diligence regarding the outcome of their decision to keep Helton. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that they'll be major moves in the coaching staff to come.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2019
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  8. TrojanHorse

    TrojanHorse Junior Member


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    #8
    I think Bohn is planning to revamp the whole support structure for USC football. USC is very antiquated in its approach to things compared to those programs that are winning on a consistent basis.

    I agree it may have been too early to make a major coaching change and some stability seemed more important that this specific change to them this year.

    But the only way this moves forward next year is if they make the same type of changes to the defense this year as they did to the offense last year. Need some fresh hungry blood that is not afraid of the work and the recruiting.
     
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  9. PickSicx

    PickSicx Junior Member


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    #9
    You think this is the bottom? This thing will get much worse. Much uglier. UCLA bad.

    Seriously? You believe this? Have you ever played football? EVERYTHING flows from the vision and leadership of the Head Coach. He's the core administrator to everything that takes place—recruitments, hiring assistant coaches, budgeting, training, game prep, in-game decision making . . .

    That's like saying that an airplane is better off without a pilot.
     
  10. CoronaTrojanFan

    CoronaTrojanFan Junior Member


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    #10
    Don't want to overdo the comparison between HCCH and Belichick/Saben discussion but I can't imagine Saban not being all over the staff involved with recruiting and replacing anybody not with the program and delivering for his recruiting responsibilities. Hearing that HCCH has pretty much given Clancy a pass on a lot of the recruiting process just seems ludicrous in this day and age of intense competition for top level recruits. Leading the recruiting process is on HCCH regardless of any external issues he may have been dealing with regarding his job future or status at USC.
     
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  11. 1980trojan

    1980trojan Points Member


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    #11
    That's what they were hired for. Making huge decisions is a crucial part of their job responsibility. They made a huge decision by keeping Helton. The problem is that it was the wrong decision. The legacy of USC Football going forward, is on Folt and Bohn. They created this situation and now they have to wear it. The problem is we fans and alumni are collateral damage and don't mean a damn thing to the administration.
    Let's be honest here, Helton has proven that he is not a great or even good coach at this level. But, self survival is part of human nature. Honestly ask yourself if someone is willing to pay you millions of dollars despite your inability to produce at a mediocre level at best, would you walk away from those paychecks? I think not.
    It's like that old saying, "Don't hate the player, hate the game." Despite what you think of Helton, he's been playing a winning game. It's the people that keep him in his current position that are losing. They have bought into his act hook line and sinker. For what ever the reason, in spite of all the evidence shown to remove Helton, he continues to cash those checks and sails along without a care in the world. Thanks Dr. Folt and AD Bohn.

    Fight On!
     
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  12. Jay4usc

    Jay4usc Points Member


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    #12
    What about discipline, penalties and injuries? Last three years the team is averaging 25 injuries which seems to be the most in power 5.
     
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  13. TrojanHorse

    TrojanHorse Junior Member


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    #13
    Are there stats kept on that?

    There is something too that. If that is consistent it is more than just "bad luck"
     
  14. Rodgarnay51

    Rodgarnay51 Junior Member


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    #14
    Add Baxter and you have a solid post, IMO.
     
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  15. Rodgarnay51

    Rodgarnay51 Junior Member


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    #15
    Agree.
     
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  16. Rodgarnay51

    Rodgarnay51 Junior Member


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    #16
    Great post except about Bohn and Folt. Bohn especially should have been up to speed his first day on the job. He did not exactly hit the ground running.
     
  17. Rodgarnay51

    Rodgarnay51 Junior Member


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    #17
    As with vball's point, I disagree with this post. Bohn should have been prepared the minute he took the job. It did not exactly require deep digging to figure out that the team had coaching issues. He should have been prepared to either fire Helton or present a compelling case - with Folt's input - for retaining him from Day 1.
     
  18. Jay4usc

    Jay4usc Points Member


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    #18
    Google it and you can find the stats
     
  19. 1980trojan

    1980trojan Points Member


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    #19
    Exactly to the point
     

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