Clay Helton + #2, #10, #4 and #4 Recruiting Classes = 5-7 record.....

Discussion in 'GarryP's Trojan Huddle' started by SCFaninUtah, Jan 14, 2019.

  1. desertfoxx

    desertfoxx Member


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    #21
    I agree with the comments of players lost for various reasons those recruiting classes have cratered .. it seems Helton just accepts these transfers and never fights to keep those he worked so hard to recruit.. show me a person in any walk of life that does not fight to keep what he has and accepts failure and you will find ... no need to finish this thought
     
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  2. sctrojan2006

    sctrojan2006 Junior Member


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    #22
    Bingo. There have been over 20% (15 players) out of the 2015-2107 recruiting classes that have either transferred or been kicked off the team. Something is wrong with the culture of the program. This falls directly on Helton's shoulders.
     
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  3. KANDI11

    KANDI11 Junior Member


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    #23
    SC was ranked in the Top 4 pre season and PC’s last 3 recruiting classes were in the Top 5. It was very much like 2018 considering it was a PC team.
     
  4. sctrojan2006

    sctrojan2006 Junior Member


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    #24
    I agree with this.

    To add to your point, PC managed to beat both UCLA and ND in 2009. Helton lost both of those games in 2018. The only thing similar to 2018 was starting True Freshman QBs and the starting QB missing one game due to injuries. Both happened in 2009 and 2018 (Barkley/Corp and Daniels/Sears). The big OC game in 2009 was at theOSU, where PC's team came out with the victory. The 2018 OC game was @Texas where Helton's team came out with the L. Outside of the QB starting situation, they were vastly different seasons.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
  5. Hockey10

    Hockey10 Junior Member


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    #25
    You being a coach can't you see Helton's inadequacies? His inability to develop all the talent he recruits, His poorly ran practices, his decisions on starters, his gumbo offense, the lack of team discipline, his mismanagement of timeouts, his inability to make in game or halftime adjustments, and so on and so on. I get he isn't getting help from above but all these things are coaching matters. They are decisions made by the coach. Knowledge of a coach. You as a coach can you honestly say he is good at these things? He isn't and we all know it. Some knew it earlier then others but the truth is the truth. When you ask yourself simple coaching questions about him the facts are all there.
     
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  6. Hockey10

    Hockey10 Junior Member


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    #26
    This is another ridiculous and desperate attempt to save face for Helton. A major portion of the reason for losing all these kids is Helton's fault. He plays favoritism and not the best players. CLancy doesn't rotate so recruits don't get playing time. We recruit so many WR's that they all can't play. When kids are getting injured at the rate our players were you have to bring into question the S&C program and the preparation in practices. Soft practices lead to injuries. There isn't any competition for starters. No rotation so kids who are good enough to play are wasting away on the bench. Then there's no development happening also. Do you fault them for transferring? Helton needs to stop over recruiting positions, fill needs, open competition, rotate players, and run a physical program to prevent injuries if he wants to stop losing so many players. Yes I know all teams lose players and we'll still lose some but these are major contributors.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
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  7. sctrojan2006

    sctrojan2006 Junior Member


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    #27
    Not at all. It is to the contrary. Who do you think is responsible for the transfers and expelled players? It is the head coach. This is happening on Helton's watch. If he is such a poor judge of character that recruits players like Osa Masina, Bryce Dixon, Jack Jones, etc., then he needs to own the disciplinary issues that follow. Losing 20%+ of the recruited players to transfers and expulsions is indicative of a problem with his program and the culture he developed.
     
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  8. Hockey10

    Hockey10 Junior Member


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    #28
    You must have misread my post. I was saying the transfers were Helton's fault and I didn't get into the part about researching the recruits behaviors and backrounds before signing them because I didn't want to open that can of worms but it is a very valid point. Reread my post and add your post and it explains why we have lost so many recruits due to Helton.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2019
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  9. TrojanHorse

    TrojanHorse Junior Member


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    #29
    What an original idea for a new thread
     
  10. Conquestluvr

    Conquestluvr Junior Member


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    #30
    At halftime at Notre Dame USC looked like they were on their way to a NC.

    They then came out for the 2nd half and barely hung on to win.
    The rest of the year was very much as bad as 2018. None of this years losses were as bad as the blowouts against Oregon and Stanford.
    PC looked stressed on the sidelines.

    I will never understand what happened at half time at ND in 2009.
     
  11. Jay4usc

    Jay4usc Points Member


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    #31
    You think it’s the coaches fault that Joseph Lewis assualted a woman?
     
  12. sctrojan2006

    sctrojan2006 Junior Member


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    #32
    No, everyone is ultimately responsible for their own actions. However, I think it is the coaches fault that there is a lack of discipline with his program, and there are numerous players having legal problems. Either they are doing a piss poor job of evaluating character or the environment around the program is conducive to nefarious behavior.
     
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  13. travyav

    travyav Junior Member


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    #33
    I'm not holding Helton accountable for the three players you listed, he wasn't there rooting on Masina and Don Hill to spit roast that girl. I think these players would have been recruited by any USC coach and sometimes you just miss. Boys will be boys. Now, if these guys had a history of these actions, while at USC, and it didn't get nipped in the bud, that is on Helton, but you can't blame Helton for young, dumb boys being young, dumb boys. This kind of stuff used to get swept under the rug. Now, the Bubba situation, that is totally different, I think that one is on Helton and the school, but that is an opinion based on my limited knowledge of the situation.
     
  14. wyotrojans

    wyotrojans Junior Member


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    #34
    This is a solid take. Although I’m not convinced if given all of the resources he would consistently flourish. There’s have been so many blunders from Helton the past 2 years.

    But yes, his bosses are as bad as him.
    5-7 in a shitty conference is flat inexcusable.
     
  15. TrueTrojan

    TrueTrojan Junior Member


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    #35

    2009 was a result of PC's compete attitude. He had to win the recruiting #1 place every year which mean bringing on guys who got high points with recruiting services like RB's and WR's. Remember when we had like 6 RB's on the roster and 3 lb's? Pete shot himself in the foot by not recruiting for defense .
     
  16. AlbertoC

    AlbertoC Junior Member


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    #36
    It's entirely due to that darned #10 class.
     
  17. Ride Fly

    Ride Fly Junior Member


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    #37
    Hear hear! Unbelievable some folks still love to bash PC.
     
  18. Ricky Bell 42

    Ricky Bell 42 Junior Member


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    #38
    better than WSU?
     
  19. SC200SC

    SC200SC Junior Member


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    #39
    Yep, Helton should have known that Massina was going to be charged with rape in an out of state event.
    .
    For me, and I am a pretty good judge of character, I thought that Dillon Baxter was the best recruit since Reggie. If not better. I researched him a lot, etc.
    Dillon Baxter turned out to be a train wreck.
    .
    Helton uses similar approaches to recruiting that John Wooden did. Wooden would watch very carefully how the recruit would interact with their parent(s) during "in home" visits. He was known to walk away from "Blue Chips" if there was an issue detected. Beyond this the idea that Helton should have detected certain character flaws, or predicted criminal/anti social behavior is pretty silly. Seems like piling on to me.

    I have 51 employees in my org chart. I diligently try to weed potential problems out at the initial interview time. I am currently running at approx. 85% success which means I have a 15% failure rate. This happens to be in the top 1/3 of my company.
    It is the way society is going these days, and I am pretty sure most football coaches/recruiters are facing this challenge these days as well.
    My concern has not so much been the recruits dismissed but rather the inordinate amount of those injured in 2018.
     
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  20. ConquerorSC

    ConquerorSC Points Member


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    #40
    Excuses.
     

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